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Vitalik, 42 days in Chiang Mai

Vitalik, 42 days in Chiang Mai

ChaincatcherChaincatcher2024/11/15 09:44
By:Foresight News

This is Vitalik's first face-to-face interview with a Chinese Web3 media outlet. In nearly 90 minutes, Vitalik discussed a large number of new Web3 applications and his thoughts on them, sharing many observations about Chinese elements.

Author: Zhou Zhou, Foresight News

Chiang Mai, an internationalized rural area, has recently been home to Vitalik for about 42 days. For someone who averages 55 flights a year and is almost "moving" every week, staying in one city for such an extended period is quite rare.

During these 42 days, a bottom-up, decentralized social life experiment took place, eventually attracting over 1,000 blockchain practitioners from around the world to Chiang Mai, spontaneously forming 8 or 9 cities and villages (Pop-Up City). They aimed to establish a "Web3 City" lasting six weeks.

Vitalik referred to this as Zuzalu 2.0. Since he initiated the first "pop-up city experiment" Zuzalu in Montenegro in 2023, he has been looking for ways to continue this social experiment. "Watching the development of Zuzalu 2.0 feels like watching my son grow up step by step," Vitalik told me.

The crypto industry often wears two distinct faces: one filled with high-risk financial transactions and activities, and the other with idealists attempting to create a new "utopia" based on blockchain's decentralization and incentive mechanisms.

"Over these six weeks, there were 1,606 events held, including meditation, hiking, Muay Thai, sound healing, Web3 lectures, and geek boot camps… The largest village, Edge City, had nearly 500 people," said Jiang, co-founder of Social Layer. Here, builders initiated activities using Social Layer rather than the more standardized and commercialized Luma. Beyond Edge City, there were other "villages," such as the "Invisible Garden," centered around global ZK developers, and "Shan Hai Wu," focused on Chinese Web3 practitioners, both exceeding 100 participants. This has allowed experiments like Zuzalu to have a legacy.

The significant increase in the density and breadth of Web3 talent has turned this place into a temporary "playground" for Vitalik's ideas. He visits two or three "Web3 villages" almost daily, engaging with the villagers. When he shared this with me, I noticed he could recall the location and characteristics of each village in detail, even down to the distance and direction.

The intensive visits and conversations undoubtedly brought him many new ideas, and some new systematic thoughts began to take shape in his mind. In this conversation, Vitalik extensively discussed his thoughts on Ethereum's ecological applications, pointing out that the technology has reached a certain level of maturity, and it's time to start focusing on applications. He shared several of the latest Web3 applications he learned about in Chiang Mai. Additionally, he talked about his observations on crypto institutions like Solana and Binance, as well as Chinese elements such as Tencent AI Labs and "The Three-Body Problem," and finally shared his lifestyle, habits, and hobbies.

To this end, Foresight News invited Vitalik for an offline interview in one of Chiang Mai's "villages"—Shan Hai Wu—to share his observations and thoughts during this period. Below is the text content.

42 Days in Chiang Mai

Joe: Hello everyone, I am Zhou Zhou from Foresight News. I am very pleased to invite Ethereum founder Vitalik for this interview. Vitalik, could you introduce yourself?

Vitalik: Hello everyone, I am Vitalik Buterin, a well-known Dogecoin holder.

Joe: That's a very iconic introduction. You have stayed in Chiang Mai for quite a long time, over 30 days. What kind of people and events attracted you?

Vitalik: I often move from one place to another. I remember averaging 55 flights a year, not including layovers. However, in Chiang Mai, I stayed for six weeks without moving, feeling it was a great opportunity to work and rest simultaneously. Of course, I found that there were many activities happening every day in Chiang Mai.

Last year in Montenegro, I conducted an experiment called Zuzalu. People reported that it was very successful as an experiment, but we were all unclear about what the next step would be. During the time between Token2049 in Singapore and Devcon in Bangkok (about seven weeks), some people initiated pop-up activities in Chiang Mai. Initially, it was just a few, but then it grew larger. It can be said that it eventually evolved into Zuzalu 2.0, supported by the same fund (the Zuzalu Fund). I am the initiator and founder of Zuzalu 1.0, and watching the development of Zuzalu 2.0 feels like watching my son grow up step by step.

There are indeed many interesting things and communities here, with seven or eight larger Pop-Ups, each with its unique characteristics. For example, (currently) in Shan Hai Wu, many interesting activities are happening, both technical and non-technical, including various meditation activities.

The Invisible Garden is 900 meters away, focusing on ZK and Ethereum-related projects; three kilometers to the east is MegaZu, a project emphasizing developer culture in Ethereum L2 technology, conducting a boot camp for developing applications; one kilometer east of MegaZu is Web3 Village, a Vietnamese community with some interesting talks and activities; another kilometer further east is Edge City, which is very large, possibly having around 300 people, with different content every week. Last week they had an event related to stablecoins, and this week there is one about Dapps.

Every time you visit a pop-up, you will find different people, different activities, and different topics of discussion, making it particularly interesting.

Joe: You participate in activities almost every day in Chiang Mai. During this process, how has your understanding and perception of Crypto changed?

Vitalik: In Shan Hai Wu, I found that people in the Ethereum community discuss two questions. The first question is why they are interested in Ethereum; the second question is what the challenges of Ethereum are.

Vitalik, 42 days in Chiang Mai image 0

On the internet, many people express opinions that I find strange, such as that Ethereum's values are useless and that Crypto is a gambling market. However, in the Ethereum community, there are some people, including many Chinese, whose goal in participating in Ethereum is because we have some values and life ideals that we particularly value. We want to create an open world, a decentralized blockchain and platform, and we aim to develop sustainable applications that contribute positively to society. That's what our community members would say.

But we haven't achieved this for a long time. Why? Because before this year, our technology wasn't good enough. In 2021, we only had L1, without L2. The transaction fees on Ethereum's L1 could be $1, $5, or even more. Last year we had many L2s, but these L2s weren't secure enough, and their wallet user experiences were poor.

This year, we can see some changes. First, Optimistic and Arbitrum in L2 have reached Stage 1. According to a framework I developed two or three years ago, if you are not Stage 1, you are essentially a multi-signature wallet, with no secure connection to Ethereum. But Optimistic and Arbitrum have reached that stage. First, security has improved, and second, transaction fees have decreased significantly. In February of this year, the average transaction fee on L2 was $0.4, and now it can sometimes be as low as $0.004.

There has been an interesting trend in the tech industry over the past two decades: people have proposed some interesting ideas early on, but it may take many years for anyone to realize them. However, suddenly, ten or twenty years later, when the technology becomes good enough, these ideas come to fruition.

Since 2014, I have been interested in the topic of prediction markets. I participated in Augur (a prediction market platform founded in 2014) in 2020, but at that time, there weren't many users, and my own user experience was poor. In early 2021, I wrote an article titled "Prediction Markets Tales from the Election," where I earned $58,000, but I paid $1,000 in transaction fees. Now, Polymarket, based on Polygon, can be said to be almost free.

Prediction markets existed in 2014, and for ten years, entrepreneurs have been trying to create prediction markets, but it wasn't until 2024 that Polymarket suddenly became popular. Why could these applications become a reality? I believe two key reasons are lower transaction fees and faster transaction confirmation speeds.

Blockchain is not a standalone technology; it may require various other technologies to mature before applications can explode. If you are a developer wanting to create blockchain applications, the first scenario is that users pay $5 for each transaction, the second scenario is $0.5, and the third is $0.005. In the first scenario, the only possible successful applications are high-value, high-risk financial products.

Farcaster is another very interesting example. They use a hybrid on-chain and off-chain architecture. Their important information, such as account registration, is on-chain, while the messages users send are off-chain. They have an interesting decentralized off-chain storage method. Each time someone registers an account or shares important information, they need to send a transaction, which incurs a transaction fee. If a transaction costs $5 or $15, that application is entirely unlikely to succeed. However, if the transaction fee is $0.001 or $0.05, it becomes feasible.

Thus, our industry has entered a situation where many idealistic blockchain practitioners want to create non-financial applications, solve identity issues, and develop decentralized governance, but the only successful applications are high-risk financial ones. Because if the transaction fee is $5, high-risk finance is the only thing you can do. If the transaction fee drops to $0.005, many previously impossible things become possible.

So I believe many blockchain applications are experiencing a new trend change, with many previously impossible things now becoming possible.

Joe: Besides Polymarket and Farcaster, which you often mention, what other interesting applications did you see during your time in Chiang Mai?

Vitalik: I found that MegaZu is working on some particularly fun applications.

In 2018, I saw an interesting application where they wanted to create a crypto event platform. Sometimes an event might have 200 people registered, but neither the organizers nor the registrants know whether 100, 50, or 20 people will actually attend.

So their model is "trustworthy commitment." If participants register, they must send 0.01 or 0.02 Ether; if they don't attend, they lose their Ether. If they do attend, they receive a portion of the Ether contributed by those who did not participate. This ensures that most registrants will attend the event.

I think this application's idea is particularly interesting; it can help us solve some everyday problems. This application was developed in 2018, but there hasn't been much news since then. I suspect it's because the blockchain transaction fees and user experience were not good enough back then. Now, MegaZu has many developers working on applications based on this idea, which I find interesting.

"Many Web3 Applications Are Now Possible"

Joe: How do you and the Ethereum Foundation view the current situation where the community believes there are too many infrastructures and not enough applications?

Vitalik: I see some critics in our community who say that Ethereum philosophers love to talk about technology but dislike discussing applications.

Why is that? Initially, we couldn't do applications well because our technology wasn't complete. Now that our technology has reached a certain level, we can start developing applications. So now we need a community focused on application development. We need both technology and applications. This is also the advantage of the diversity within the Ethereum community.

I think the best approach is not to tell those working on L1 to develop applications; the best thing they can do is focus on L1 issues. What we need to do is provide more opportunities for newcomers in the community and give them more space. The first point is to give them freedom, and the second is to provide them with more support.

Joe: Will there be more specific measures?

Vitalik: The first is support within the community. If some people are working on important applications, they can share what they are doing within the community; that's the first step.

Second, many people are particularly good at creating user-friendly products, but they may not be as skilled in blockchain technology and the integration of L1, L2, and wallets. We also need organizations that connect with teams more, such as community organizations, hackathons, etc.

Another point is that the foundation is expanding a team recently, and the goal of this expansion is to maintain more relationships with wallets, such as MetaMask, OKX, Rabbit, etc. Because wallets have many direct connections with users.

Joe: What are the top three products you hope to see built on Ethereum?

Vitalik: I have mentioned Polymarket and Farcaster many times in the past year, not just because I like these two examples, but because they both represent a very promising category. Polymarket can be classified as a combination of finance and new media. Twenty years ago, we had traditional media; ten years ago, we had social media, but now many people no longer trust traditional and social media.

Everyone talks about wanting to create better Web3 social media, but they merely add crypto payment features to existing products, which has failed. How did social media succeed? When Twitter first emerged, its goal was not to become the next Facebook; when Douyin and TikTok first appeared, their goal was not to become the next Twitter. We need to invent a new category and track, rather than just tweaking existing categories and tracks to do better.

I would place Polymarket in the media category. If I want to know what is happening in the world, I now have a habit of checking Polymarket. Or when the media reports that something has happened, I will check Polymarket to see if it is significant. Or I directly check Polymarket to see if anything important has happened recently. If you see a large betting amount on an event at Polymarket, you will be curious about what exactly happened.

Vitalik, 42 days in Chiang Mai image 1

Image Source: Polymarket (2024 US Presidential Election, $3.6 billion wagered globally)

Traditional, social, and Web3 media coexisting in three different ways is interesting. Polymarket has two ways to participate: the first way is if you have money, you can participate in this market; the second way is if you don't have money, you can still observe the market's results. I believe this combination of market and non-market has many opportunities. I don't yet know what these opportunities are, but I believe there will be many.

Regarding Farcaster, I think social products need to incorporate some crypto elements. Currently, the biggest problem for crypto entrepreneurs is that they tend to split into two extremes: one group only creates applications that can make money but lack long-term sustainability and significance; the other group focuses solely on users but has no revenue.

The first problem is that entrepreneurs are not making money; the second problem is that if users are not idealists, they are unwilling to participate. A successful Web3 application will combine these two aspects.

SocialFi also has a history outside of blockchain. For example, in 2012, there was a project called Diaspora that aimed to create a decentralized Facebook, but they ultimately failed. Now, projects like Bluesky and Threads face two problems. The first problem is that they cannot monetize, so they lack sufficient resources to do great things.

The second problem is that if users are not idealists, what motivates them to move from Twitter? If we can find a way to combine these two aspects, it would be perfect. But no one has fully accomplished this yet. Finding a way to merge idealism with profitability is very important.

Joe: Do you pay attention to applications in ecosystems like Solana and TON?

Vitalik: Sometimes I chat with people from Solana about what interests them and the topics they are currently thinking about. Some people are genuinely trying to turn Depin into the internet or the next generation of infrastructure.

As for exchanges like Binance, they have a lot of developments in some developing countries. In 2021, when we went to Argentina, I found that many people there use crypto, but I also discovered that many of them, while being crypto users, are not blockchain users.

One Christmas, I was walking outside and approached a café. The owner immediately recognized me and showed me his Binance account. I asked if I could buy coffee with Ethereum, and he said yes. The payment process took about five minutes, and the transaction confirmation time was particularly long, but that issue has now been resolved. The reason I am also concerned about this topic is that we hope some exchanges can accept on-chain transactions from the Ethereum chain within 12 seconds.

Joe: You just mentioned that many people are crypto users but not blockchain users. Could this be related to the fact that many on-chain actions are happening on the web rather than on mobile?

Vitalik: There are now some wallets that encourage this, such as Daimo on Base, which is a great example. Their goal is to create a decentralized wallet.

The "Crisis" of Ethereum

Joe: What do you think is the biggest crisis Ethereum is facing now? And in the past two years, what do you think has hindered the development of Web3?

Vitalik: I wonder if 2022 and 2023 were the most dangerous times; I feel we are in a better place now.

In 2022, AI exploded, and many people began to see AI as the future opportunity. Meanwhile, Crypto was viewed as relatively useless, merely a place for gambling, causing many idealistic individuals who wanted to positively impact the world to leave Crypto. As I mentioned earlier regarding transaction fees and technology issues, they became disillusioned with Crypto. I remember when I visited Silicon Valley in April 2022, chatting with some well-known AI practitioners who told me that Crypto was useless. This was before the FTX collapse, and the situation worsened after FTX.

Now, Crypto has made many successful technological advancements, and applications are starting to see more success, so I believe the current situation is somewhat better.

I still see risks in that our community has become particularly diverse. Some people focus on finance, some on cyberpunk, and others on culture, art, philosophy, etc., with differing ideas. A failed situation would be if they start to disrespect each other, with some only creating profit-driven applications while others aim to do meaningful things but lack funding. I hope these two aspects can be combined.

Joe: Solana is becoming increasingly powerful, and many believe it has become Ethereum's most important competitor. What is your view on this issue?

Vitalik: I think they are indeed much more centralized than Ethereum.

First, running a Solana node is much more difficult than running an Ethereum node; second, Solana's PoS is more centralized; third, many community initiatives are directly supported by the Solana Foundation.

They focus heavily on applications and like to talk about Depin, which involves collaborating with large companies to sell hardware and working with telecom companies to create a new internet. These applications have a characteristic of having a much lower demand for decentralization compared to Ethereum. I believe their market goals are genuinely different from those of Ethereum.

If you want a blockchain with 100 TPS, Ethereum's L1 will never meet that requirement. You have two choices: the first is to go to another high-performance blockchain, and the second is to use Ethereum L2, including Arbitrum, Base, MegaETH, etc.

So what can Ethereum do that other faster chains cannot? I assure you it is a long-term decentralized, neutral, and secure blockchain. You can look at some data charts comparing the decentralization of Ethereum's PoS mining pools with Bitcoin's mining pools, and you will find that Ethereum is more decentralized than Bitcoin.

We have successful experiences and histories in solving some of our centralization issues. One example is the client issue. Three years ago, the Ethereum network was using Geth and Prysm, and now no single client exceeds 52%.

Another example is the crisis we faced two years ago with Tornado Cash. Some began to ban certain crypto transactions, and everyone was concerned about whether the Ethereum chain would become non-neutral. A year later, you can see the situation regarding what percentage of blocks would censor those transactions. You might find that two years ago, it was over 80%, but now it has consistently been around 20% to 50%. A year or two later, you will see the results of how we resolved these issues.

Ethereum L1 is not the best place for high-performance applications. If you want to create a game, L1 is also not the best place, so we need L2. The architecture of Ethereum is designed this way. Ethereum L1's architecture is decentralized, neutral, and secure, and it should be the only one comparable to Bitcoin. L2 can focus on transaction efficiency and speed, providing a good blockchain experience for mainstream users.

Joe: Does this mean that Ethereum's ultimate form should be seamlessly hidden behind all L2s?

Vitalik: In a way, yes. The only exception is that Ethereum, as an asset, cannot succeed if no one knows about it, so from this perspective, Ethereum cannot completely become a background entity.

Ethereum needs to be known for its existence. Ethereum will not become something entirely invisible like Google Cloud. The advantage of Ethereum compared to Google Cloud is that it is normally invisible, but in critical situations, it can be visible; that distinction is important.

So, until a particularly necessary situation arises, we still need to discuss the existence of Ethereum's L1 and its advantages and characteristics.

Joe: You just mentioned AI. How often do you use AI products? Do you frequently use products like ChatGPT?

Vitalik: Yes, I sometimes use ChatGPT. I specifically bought a relatively powerful GPU for my computer, so I can also run some local models. Some of the images in my articles are actually generated by local AI.

Joe: What new things do you feel have emerged from the combination of AI and Ethereum?

Vitalik: I feel that AI and Crypto have had a significant connection over the past decade, particularly with AI participating in decentralized exchanges. This example is very interesting and represents a large and promising category.

What is this category? Crypto can use smart contracts to define the rules of a game, ensuring the game's execution is secure, and AI can participate in this game. What is this game? Decentralized exchanges are the first example, and prediction markets are the second. In the future, there may be even more examples.

Joe: There are also voices from the outside saying that Ethereum is becoming increasingly centralized from a technical mechanism perspective. How do you view this issue?

Vitalik: I find it strange when they say that because I feel Ethereum is becoming increasingly decentralized. The issues we face now are the consequences of decentralization. For example, regarding L1 client development, five years ago, we only had one client, Geth, and now we have Geth, Nethermind, Besu, etc.

Now you can visit a website called ClientDiversity.org to see what percentage of the Ethereum network is using different clients. You will find that Geth has about 52%, while others are slightly less. But no client currently exceeds 66%.

Vitalik, 42 days in Chiang Mai image 2

What happens if Geth has issues? First, the Ethereum network will not finalize because finalization requires 66% of nodes to agree. So there will be a fork, but this fork will not finalize. At this point, client developers will investigate which client has problems. When they discover that the Geth client has issues, the other clients will not change, but Geth will.

This kind of situation happened three years ago when Geth was used by about 85% of the network. As a result, everything returned to normal after 12 hours. Now, this network will not finalize. If there are applications with particularly high security requirements, they will immediately know that there may be an issue and will wait to confirm. After 12 hours, when a new version of Geth is released, there will be no problems. So the development of client decentralization is very good.

You can also look at the companies behind the clients and how they generate their revenue. In 2021, the clients were theoretically different companies, but their funding mostly came from the Ethereum Foundation. So you could say that the level of decentralization was not very strong in 2021. Why did we do this? Because we want different client companies to exist, and we want to give them a chance to grow. Now, some client companies do not need funding from the foundation, and we have recently provided very little sponsorship.

Another aspect is related to the protocol. Five years ago, I was almost the only protocol researcher. Now we have a research team of at least 20 people, some from the Ethereum Foundation and others from different teams, including some from Paradigm, who publish their ideas about the protocol, along with many other teams.

In the Ethereum ecosystem, five years ago, the largest organization was the Ethereum Foundation, followed by ConsenSys, with nothing else. Now we have the client companies mentioned earlier, ETH Global as an independent organization, and various wallets like MetaMask, Rainbow, Trust Wallet, Rabbit, etc., whereas three years ago, there was only MetaMask.

This year, a particularly concerning issue for everyone is interoperability. There are many different L2s and wallets, and their integration has encountered some problems. If we were centralized, we wouldn't have these issues.

So the problem we most want to solve now is how to maintain a decentralized ecosystem while still being able to coordinate in some important areas. We still need to improve some important standards.

Joe: You just mentioned that decentralization has also brought some problems. I have also noticed that there are discussions about L2s fighting among themselves, and Ethereum not forming a cohesive force. How do you view the perspective that various ecosystems seem to dilute Ethereum's resources?

Vitalik: I remember that discussions about this became quite frequent in August, with issues regarding different L2s and Ethereum activities feeling somewhat competitive. However, I found that after people talked about these issues, L2s, wallets, and activities were very willing to address these problems.

The day before yesterday, we had an event in Chiang Mai focused on L2 and wallet interoperability. At Devcon, there will be a larger discussion, and everyone agrees that we need more standards and interoperability between L2s, and they are willing to promote this aspect. I feel that some outsiders, in order to criticize Ethereum, will say that L2s are fighting among themselves, but if you listen to what people from L2s say and think, you will find that they do not want to fight; they want to cooperate.

Thirty and Standing, Thirty and Just

Joe: Finally, let's talk about some more personal topics. Confucius said, "At thirty, I stood firm." You also just turned 30 this year. Ten years ago, you wrote the Ethereum white paper. Today, ten years later, have you fulfilled the dreams you had back then? What will you do in the next ten years?

Vitalik: I can say I have partially fulfilled them, and I have also realized that my understanding of what we need to do has changed a lot.

A significant change is in my thinking. Ten years ago, I focused on theory, discovering new mechanisms through economics and mathematics. But now, this era is different; most of the mechanisms we can invent have already been invented. Now, more of what we do is not inventing entirely new mechanisms but optimizing what we already have. The optimization process cannot rely solely on theory; in some areas, it can, such as in cryptography and zero-knowledge proofs. However, in many areas, the only way is to experiment. Conduct experiments to see where they succeed and where they fail, and continuously improve.

For example, ten years ago, I had an idealistic idea of inventing a governance model that could be proven optimal and correct through mathematics. In many cases, you can mathematically prove something is correct, but outside of the mechanism, there are different participants, and you cannot create a governance mechanism that is guaranteed to be stable.

In "The Three-Body Problem," some scientists conducted many experiments but ultimately found that physics did not exist, leading them to commit suicide. I feel that economics has become nonexistent. If we want to do more, the only way is to experiment. If we want to optimize our public goods mechanisms now, the only way we can do it is to conduct another experiment, modify a mechanism, conduct another experiment, and continue to refine our mechanisms. I will likely do more of this in the next ten years.

Vitalik, 42 days in Chiang Mai image 3

Joe: What are your non-Crypto hobbies?

Vitalik: Walking, running, reading different books or exploring various things on the internet, and learning different languages in different places.

Joe: What types of books do you enjoy?

Vitalik: Most of them are non-fiction books, including economics, history, or sociology. You will see some people online writing long articles, which are essentially equivalent to writing a book.

Joe: Where do you generally draw your energy from? How do you adjust yourself in the morning to achieve the best state?

Vitalik: One of the most interesting aspects of my life is that I have two types of work. The first type is more introverted work, such as writing code, writing articles, and discussing topics with developers. The second type is extroverted work, which involves participating in activities.

I have found an interesting point about the relationship between these two types of work. One serves as a rest for the other. When you do one too much and need a break, you can switch to the other.

Joe: Who are your favorite writers, musicians, and philosophers?

Vitalik: This question is really hard to answer because it's difficult to say one is better than the others.

Joe: If you weren't working in Crypto, what would you be doing?

Vitalik: Before entering Crypto, I was involved in online education, so I think that would be a significant topic for me.

In the past two years, my goal has been to combine Crypto with other important technological directions. If there were no Crypto, I might also be involved in Dapp-related projects, including some related to healthcare and DCI (Data Center Interconnect). If it were related to Crypto, I would focus on community notes.

Joe: Would you consider retiring? Or disappearing like Satoshi Nakamoto?

Vitalik: If I weren't doing my current job, I would feel lonely.

Joe: What aspects of Chinese culture do you appreciate?

Vitalik: I have always found the Chinese community to be very friendly. They have various interesting ideas, and they care about building a particularly good community, focusing on the values of Ethereum and blockchain. There are also simpler points, like how delicious Chinese food is.

Joe: What Chinese dishes do you like?

Vitalik: Greens and steamed fish.

Joe: Alright, this conversation is coming to an end. Thank you, Vitalik, for accepting the interview with Foresight News. I also want to thank the Web3 practitioners from the Chinese-speaking community who contributed some questions for this interview, including Yisi, co-founder of Mask Network; Jiang, co-founder of Social Layer; Forest, co-founder of Foresight Ventures; Yuanjie, co-founder of Conflux; Sandy, co-founder of Scroll; and KOL Jason. Their questions also represent the voices of the Chinese-speaking community. Of course, I must also thank Audrey from Shan Hai Wu for her support and photographer Shaka. Thank you, everyone.**

Vitalik: Thank you.

0

Disclaimer: The content of this article solely reflects the author's opinion and does not represent the platform in any capacity. This article is not intended to serve as a reference for making investment decisions.

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